Sota-arkisto (Finnish Military archive)

[Richard T Eger]

From 12 O'Clock High!:

Kari Lumppio
Do 24s with code S5+?K at Gulf of Finland 1944
Fri May 23 23:34:30 2024
193.229.6.165

Servus!

A Finnish war time document - air surveillance log of "own flights" - contains lots of interesting data. It (or they) is among the archived documents of 7. Ilmavalvontakomppania (air surveillance company) and the Sota-arkisto (Finnish Miliatry archive) code is T6801 (omat lennot/ilmaviestikirja A).

During June-August 1944 there are numerous preannounced flights of Luftwaffe Do 24s over Gulf of Finland. Following codes are recorded:

S5+BK, S5+CK, S5+EK, S5+GK and S5+LK.

Additionally during May 1944 Do 24 KOJJ/KOII is recorded (the only Do 24 flying then). (Handwriting style on the log is so weird that one can't be sure if J or I is meant)

The latest document I have of all Luftflotte 1 is from 26 Dec, 1943 (NARA Microfilm T-311/roll 136, frame 7181856) and it shows "VII (Seenot)kdo" at Reval (= Tallinn) and "34 kdo" at Hungerburg (= Narva-Jõesuu. If not shown correctly it is Narva-Joesuu where the letter o has ~ over it).

Does S5+_K stand for Seenotkommmando 34? Can anyone verify, say for example from Flugbuch or so?


Thanking in advance,
Kari

[Richard T Eger]

From TOCH!:

Dennis Peschier
Do-24 homepage
Sat May 24 10:43:03 2024
195.169.225.205

Hello Kari,
You should really contact Andre de Zwart. He has a homepage with lots of information on the Do-24. He would be most interested in that information.
http://www.dornier24.com/

Dennis Peschier

[Richard T Eger]

From TOCH!:

Kari Lumppio
Great link. Thanks a million! (nm)
Sun May 25 19:23:28 2024
193.229.6.165

[Richard T Eger]

From TOCH!:

Rudolf Hecke
Do 24s with S5 + .K
Mon May 26 21:05:14 2024
62.104.220.76

S5 + .K war das Kennzeichen der 2./Seenotstaffel.

[Richard T Eger]

From 12 O'Clock High!:

Andreas Brekken
Bf 109E WNr blocks
Wed Sep 3 13:57:26 2024
80.213.3.180

Hi!

I was browsing through the book by Hannu Valtonen on Bf 109 today, and found a 'problem' regarding Bf 109E-1 production blocks.

He writes that the following blocks existed:

AGO built WNr 3300-3359 60 Bf 109E-1
Arado built WNr 3333 - 3664 332 Bf 109E-1

I find this a bit strange... they couldn't both have built 3333 - 3359??

I guess it is a typo or??

Andreas

[Richard T Eger]

From TOCH!:

Francis Marshall
Bf 109E WNr Blocks
Wed Sep 3 17:43:30 2024
80.128.14.249

Hei Andreas,
Prien gives (in Teil 1)
AGO 3300 - 3379 = 80 Bf 109E-1
Arado 3380 - 3664 = 442 Bf 109E-1

This should be the definitive answer!

Francis

[Richard T Eger]

From TOCH!:

Kari Lumppio
Original Messerchmitt document states the same as Valtonen
Thu Sep 4 06:51:10 2024
130.233.83.21

Hei!

Valtonen has apparently used a primary source which does indeed state exactly so (and has to be in error - haven't noticed this myself!).
The source is:
Übersichtsliste der Änderungs-Anweisungen BF109, dated 1.7.1943 (1st July).
This Messerschmitt document can be found at Sota-arkisto. It lists by WNr which BF109 individuals are affected by which modifications.

Cheers,
Kari

[Richard T Eger]

From TOCH!:

Jukka Juutinen
Well, this might be a ...
Sat Sep 6 17:00:52 2024
213.28.161.139

very small light in a very dark room since Valtonen´s book is basically a catalogue errors and an example when an author lacks humility as far as his knowledge goes.

[Richard T Eger]

The website for the Sota-arkisto, in the Finnish language, is at:

http://www.sota-arkisto.fi/hakemistot.html

In English, the Sota-arkisto: World of Learning website is at:

http://www.worldoflearning.com/views/entry/FI/3/2/12

This gives the following information about the archive:

"Sota-arkisto
Military Archives

POB 54, 00581 Helsinki
Telephone: (9) 18126544
Fax: (9) 18126505
Email: sark@sota-arkisto.fi

Founded: 1918
Central archive repository of the Defence Forces
Dir: Jaana Kilkki (M. A.)"

Further information can be found on The Nordic Wars 1939-1945 forums at:

http://www.tendens.se/nicolas/forum/...p?TOPIC_ID=393

Specifically, the following posted message is quite informative:

Posted by: Sami
Posted on: 21 Aug. 2024

"quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear all,

relatives of recently deceased Mr. Koljonen have contacted me asking to find out what were his rank and tasks in the Finnish Army in Winter War and in Continuation war. According to them, in Continuation war he was chief of Finnish coast defences. he retired after the war in the rank of Lieutenant Colonel (also according to his relatives)

with best regards,

Bair



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Hi Bair,

The Sota-arkisto is the best place to start. However, as he died recently (and thus his file isn't public), you need to get the "investigation permit" ( http://www.sota-arkisto.fi/pdf/h-tutkimuslupa.pdf ) first. Relatives & such can get the permit easily. I don't know how easy or hard it will be for you, unless you have the research request in writing (from his relative) and can attach a copy of the (possible) letter to the application.

It would be perhaps easiest, if the relative can fill and send the application, but adds to the #6 "Lisätietoja" that you Bair would be the person who would come and see the documents at Sota-arkisto. Another option would be that the relative(s) makes the application and orders photocopies of his "kantakortti" (+ mahdolliset liitteet) to themselves. (Definitely the easiest way, for you, to handle this).

If they have his file, it will have all the info you listed.

Cheers,
Sami"

Regards,
Richard

[Richard T Eger]

For an interesting discussion of Bf 109 Werknummern involving primarily export aircraft, plus conflicts in data from various sources, the reader is referred to the topic "Books on Bf 109 - 19" on the "References & Reference Materials" forum.

Specifically, related to the Sota-arkisto, Helsinki (Military Archive), commentary is made as to errors in the original Messerschmitt document "Übersichtsliste der Änderungs-Anweisungen BF109" which is a collection of modification orders and lists the Bf 109 (by WNr) which are affected by which modification (Änderungs-Anweisung). Subtypes covered are Bf 109 E-1 to early G-6.

Regards,
Richard